Thursday, September 22, 2005

Comic Book Urban Legends Revealed #17!

This is the seventeenth in a series of examinations of comic book urban legends and whether they are true or false. Click here for an archive of the previous sixteen.

Let's begin!

COMIC URBAN LEGEND: Steve Ditko does not use the original art that Marvel has returned to him, except sometimes as CUTTING BOARDS!

STATUS: True

The beginnings of this situation happened back when Marvel was caught up in the whole "not returning art to the original artists," using the argument that Marvel not only paid for the production of the art for the comics, but for the art itself. In any event, after some time, Marvel eventually relented, under the following condition - it would give the artists back the art, but it would be as a GIFT due to Marvel's generosity. They still believe that THEY (Marvel) own the work fair and square, but would allow the artists to have the work itself.

Well, Steve Ditko did not like that arrangement.

As a result of this (and other factors I am sure, like not wanting to look to his past and hell, probably some other stuff, damned if I know), Ditko basically just let the art pile up, and actually used some of his old work as cutting boards!!

The story appeared in an issue of Wizard a few years back (thanks to Linda Burns at Ditkoland, for transcribing this last year):
There's simply no way to separate the fact from the fiction, no way to determine which Ditko is the real Ditko. One story about him contradicts the next, which-in turn-contradicts the next.

Take for example, one of [Comic publisher and restorer, Greg] Theakston's last visits to Ditko's studio. While embroiled in a conversation, the historian noticed a piece of illustration board leaning up against a wall, slashed to pieces.

"He'd been using it as a cutting board," Theakston said. "I looked a little bit closer and I detected a comics code stamp on it."

He asked Ditko to turn the board around, a request met with a deadening gaze from the artist.

"I didn't think he was going to do it," the historian recounted. "It looked like a 'Screw you' look."

Slowly, however, Ditko reached out and flipped over the board. It was a page of original art from a late 1950s issue of Journey Into Mystery, a splash featuring a hard helmet diver. Theakston couldn't believe it. Not only was Ditko not displaying, preserving or prizing this piece of original art, he was using it as a cutting board.

Theakston quickly offered Ditko a deal: "Steve, I will go down to the nearest art supply store and buy you a cutting board that will mend itself-a plastic cutting board that's so smart that when you cut on it, it mends itself-and you'll have the finest cutting board on the block." "Nope," Ditko replied, twisting the artwork-turned-cutting-board back around.

Theakston pleaded. "Steve, geez. That's worth a fair amount of money. At the very least-damn, Steve-it's an artifact. It's an important piece of publishing history in terms of comics."

The artist turned and pointed to the drapery-obscured window next to Theakston's chair. "Lift that curtain up," he said.

The curtain, the historian estimated, was about 18 inches off the floor. He pulled the drape aside and saw a stack of original artwork from Marvel standing roughly a foot-and-a-half high.

"Can I look at these?" Theakston excitedly asked.

"No."

The writer was dumbfounded. "I was sitting next to a hundred thousand, two hundred thousand dollars, maybe, worth of Ditko artwork and he was cutting it up without letting people look at it."

For whatever reason-Theakston feels Ditko may have thought Marvel was wrong for returning the pages-the artist seemed to attach no particular affection to his early work.

"He would rather not have people think of Steve Ditko's best work as being Spider-Man from 30 or 40 years ago," the historian said. "He wanted to be represented not by what he had done, but by what he's doing-he wants now to be his best time.
Amazing, isn't it?

COMIC URBAN LEGEND: Robert Loren Fleming is dead.

STATUS: False

This is a weird little urban legend (which was suggested by reader MarkAndrew), and has been making the rounds for at LEAST the past couple of years (as I remember reading it at the time, and worrying about it, then, until I found out it was false).

In any event, just recently, in the comments section on the super duper blog, Snark Free Waters, Dan Coyle (who will always be Dan Boyle to me...hehe), asked "Wait, Robert Fleming's not dead? I could have sworn I read an article around the time Ambush Bug returned in the pages of Lobo Unbound referring to him as "the late Robert Loren Fleming."

Apparently, this comment in Lobe Unbound, coupled with Mr. Fleming not doing any big mainstream comic work, was cause to believe the claims in the comic book.

Mr. Fleming himself showed up later in the comments section of that fantabulous comic blog, Snark Free Waters, to state, "Fleming here, back from the dead... ....p.s.: Those bus crashes really smart!"

So it was all just a joke by Keith Giffen.

Good thing, too, because Robert Loren Fleming is a fine writer. It would be a shame to lose him too soon.

COMIC URBAN LEGEND: The first Marvel/DC crossover was The Wizard of Oz.

STATUS: True

A lot of people generally think that Superman vs. Spider-Man, in 1976, was the first Marvel/DC crossover, but in fact, the first crossover happened a full year earlier!

Both DC and Marvel had been trying to obtain the rights to publish an adaptation of the Wizard of Oz, and ultimately, the decided to just publish the book TOGETHER.

It was this spirit of cooperation, I presume, which led to the other, more memorable, crossover a year later.

Image hosted by Photobucket.com

Marvel AND DC Presents...wow, we really AREN'T in Kansas anymore!

Well, that's it for me this week!

Feel free to tell me some urban legends you have heard, and I will try to confirm or deny them!

Read More

83 Comments:

Blogger Matthew said...

I thought the first marvel/dc crossover (were the characters met) was some random fundraiser comic written by... kurt busiek (or someone) when they were a teenager.
I'm sure I read something like that somewhere...

9/22/2005 07:48:00 AM  
Blogger Greg said...

But couldn't it have been someone POSING as Fleming? The new urban legend could be that he's alive!

9/22/2005 09:37:00 AM  
Blogger Chris Arndt said...

I read elsewhere that the cutting board thing was false.

9/22/2005 10:40:00 AM  
Anonymous Dan Coyle said...

But given the stories I've heard about Ditko's attitude, it seems true. I've heard from a well-known Marvel artist that Marvel's offered Ditko a stipend for Spider-Man several times, but he refuses to take it.

I did hear a rumor that Ditko did see the Spider-Man movie, the first one at least, and liked it for the most part.

9/22/2005 10:55:00 AM  
Blogger MarkAndrew said...

I was gonna request that you disprove the "Robert Loren Fleming is dead" legend the next time you did one of these. But you beat me to it.

Wonder if there's a chance we'll get to see more comic work out of Mr. RLF ever. Thriller and Ambush Bug rate as two of my favorite comics ever.

9/22/2005 01:26:00 PM  
Blogger Brian Cronin said...

"I read elsewhere that the cutting board thing was false."

Certainly possible, Chris. But for it to be false, Treakston would have to be just outright lying, right?

Why do that (on his part)?

9/22/2005 04:33:00 PM  
Blogger Brian Cronin said...

Matthew, the Wizard of Oz adaptation was written by Roy Thomas, with art by John Romita.

9/22/2005 04:37:00 PM  
Blogger T. said...

I was just about to ask if that was Romita. That art is sweet. I wish he'd do a Batman story before he dies. If Stan can do some DC work, why not Jazzy Johnny.

By the way, my blog is fixed (was down for a second). Lots of new posts. What a whore I am.

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9/22/2005 05:40:00 PM  
Blogger T. said...

I'd love to see an autobiographical move of Steve Ditko, sort of with a sensibility like American Splendor or like Beautiful Mind. The guy is just a fascinating eccentric genius personality, what a great flick that would be, even for people who don't even like comics.

9/22/2005 06:10:00 PM  
Blogger Goody said...

Great site!

9/22/2005 07:16:00 PM  
Blogger layne said...

The Ditko thing makes sense, in a Howard Roark kind a way, which is to say, KER-AY-ZAY!
Bless that man.

9/22/2005 07:30:00 PM  
Anonymous A.L. Baroza said...

I'm pretty sure it was John Buscema who did the interior of the Oz Treasury. The Grand Comics Database confirms this.

And yay for Steve Ditko. Shine on, you crazy diamond.

9/23/2005 12:20:00 AM  
Blogger Brian Cronin said...

That's what Marvel gets for having two famous Johns...hehe.

I wrote Romita when I meant to write Buscema.

Romita did the cover, so I must have been thinking Romita when I wrote down the creative team.

Good pick up, A.L.!

9/23/2005 05:02:00 AM  
Blogger Brian Cronin said...

And thank you, Goody.

9/23/2005 05:02:00 AM  
Anonymous Rob Allen said...

The story I've read about the Oz book is that Marvel was ready to go to press with it when they discovered that DC actually owned the rights. So Marvel offered to share the profits and DC agreed. Content-wise, it's a Marvel book.

12/20/2005 08:10:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I vaguely recall something about characters from both companies being involved in a Halloween parade in Rutland, Vermont on a regular basis. Does this make a difference in the crossover issue?

2/15/2006 01:49:00 AM  
Anonymous tbrittreid/Ted Watson said...

"The first Marvel/DC crossover was 'The Wizard of Oz'...."

Depends on your definition of first. The first Superman/Spider-man tabloid was released first. Period.

3/02/2006 03:44:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Um, why doesn't Ditko just return the art to Marvel? If he believes that Marvel is the rightful owner of the art, shouldn't he refrain from destroying it?

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Los Suenos Condominiums,
Los Suenos Condo Rental

2/26/2014 05:16:00 PM  

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